hey what is going on you guys welcome
back to the channel so I am here with
somebody it kind of a funny story
actually him and I were basically
neighbors for our entire lives and then
I was scrolling through Facebook about
two months ago and I saw an article
about how your company had just raised
over a million dollars and I was like
what is this kid up to and I know you
guys have enjoyed these videos in the
past for I interview like real-life
entrepreneurs and so I invited him he
actually drove all the way up from New
York City which is about a three-hour
drive for this video so we certainly do
appreciate that
and I just kind of want to get his
backstory here about what his company is
you know and I feel like there's so many
questions people have for young
entrepreneurs like did you go to college
do you recommend college and all kinds
of that different stuff but first of all
thanks for coming up and that man good
to see ya so why don't we start off with
what exactly is your company power spike
that you've created here or are you the
founder I am one of one of three
founders okay one of three founders okay
yeah so our company power spike was
started when we had this really
interesting experience probably about
five years ago where we were creating
eSports tournaments on Twitch and if
you're not familiar with these sports
it's essentially competitive video
gaming where people are running these
tournaments and players are competing in
them for prizes so I was part of this
eSports organization that was creating
these events on Twitch and we ran into
this really interesting problem where we
were getting tens of thousands of
viewers on every single one of our
events and they were super successful
but we had really limited ways to
monetize it and actually build a
sustainable source of income for the
business and we were spending about like
$1,000 to $3,000 a week just trying to
cover these prize pools which was crazy
so essentially what we ended up doing
was we looked at a few different ways to
monetize the business one of them being
pre-roll ads that we put on the twitch
stream and at the time most people were
using an ad blocker so that was yeah
that didn't work for yeah a bit of a bit
of a challenge and then on top of that
there were other methods that we looked
at which were donations from our
community but the challenge with that is
that's sort of an unreliable source of
this much and then another one
you'll get that much so it was really
hard to predict how we could actually
cover those cash flows and then the
other option that we looked at were
sponsorships and advertisements that we
could put on the channel where we could
use the influence and the viewership
that we built up over time to endorse
different products so we had this really
interesting experience where we reached
out to about a hundred different brands
and advertisers looking for a
sponsorship opportunity and I think we
got two responses back and both of them
were rejection letters oh my gosh yeah I
find that too were like you'll send ha a
hundred emails and like if you get I
find like five percent response rate
that's even good people like never
respond to that stuff it's crazy and it
was a super good less than cold emailing
right but for us as creators it was it
was sort of discouraging because we were
like wow we've got all this viewership
but it's so challenging to get an actual
sponsorship mm-hmm so what ended up
happening long story short we took that
lesson on the chin and we ended up
starting power spike because we wanted
to create a better way for creators like
ourselves to actually go out and find
sponsorship opportunities on platforms
like twitch so we ended up creating that
platform about almost five years ago now
at this point and we've just simply
grown it over time to work with a whole
roster of different clients and brands
and advertisers and we work with some of
the top creators on Twitch today as well
Wow so basically you haven't gone
through that experience the pain point
of like being a twitch streamer with a
bunch of eyeballs on you and no way to
really make money with it in a reliable
way
and so you were basically so to explain
what it is that power spike does you
basically are the bridge between the
influencers and the advertisers or the
the big brands in that space yeah
exactly so we help connect influencers
who want to get a sponsor a sponsorship
on their channel with a brand or
advertiser that wants to provide that
okay and there's a lot of interesting
challenges that go along with that right
so if you're a creator you want to focus
on creating content and you want to
focus on running our YouTube channel or
running a twitch stream and doing what
you're great at which is working with
your community and creating interesting
content if you're a brand or advertiser
you come for more of a business
perspective and you're really looking
for viewership or clicks or whatever it
may be that your goal is or even sales
for your business so it's
really interesting because we tried a
few different approaches to the
marketplace at first where we would just
kind of connect everybody together and
we found that it was a really tough
connection to make because a lot of
times creators have a it's challenging
when it comes to working with brands
because the incentives and what each
party is looking for aren't always
necessarily aligned so putting them
together a lot of times creators might
not necessarily understand all of the
kind of jargon that goes along with like
a specific brand or advertiser and what
they're looking for and how to actually
sell into these businesses because it's
just not what any creator wants to
really do it's not necessarily what
they're good at
um so really what we looked at for our
approach to the marketplace and how
we've essentially structured this is
instead of making a brand or advertiser
go work directly with all the creators
and have to manage a program on their
own we've essentially created a platform
where any brand or advertiser can come
to us and essentially start working with
creators just like they would buy an ad
on Facebook or Google okay yeah because
I think that's really what and it's
funny because I was talking to AJ about
this I've experienced the same exact
struggle with trying to buy influence or
promotions on Instagram which is where I
were basically I would be looking to get
a better deal for my money because you
know as far as the marketplaces like
Facebook and YouTube and doing Google
Ads like you're paying up a lot for
those ads now because that's what
everybody's doing
so I personally was like okay I'm gonna
try to go after some influential
promotions to try to get a better deal
better you know cost per click or
whatever that metric is but like after
doing it and I only did two thousand
dollars of spend I've spent hours like
DMing Instagram influencers hey do you
do paid promos okay how do I pay you
okay I just paid you when you're gonna
run them yeah and there's just so many
like annoying it's just not a good like
process for doing that yeah totally it's
really complicated right if you're a
brand or advertiser who wants to work
with a creator on YouTube or Facebook or
Instagram or twitch or whatever the
channel made me you have to remember at
the end of the day that it's not like
buying an ad on Facebook right like
these are people at the end of the day
that you're dealing with and everybody
has their own individual ways that
they'd like to be
indicated with everybody has their own
channel that they'd like to work through
so at the end of the day if you're a
brand or advertiser there's so many
different steps that you're gonna have
to go through to actually run an
influencer campaign I mean just think
about it you have to first off you got
to identify who you want to work with so
you have to search through hundreds of
YouTube channels or Instagram posts to
figure out which type of creators are
actually going to be relevant for your
industry if you're a financial services
company you want to find people who
speak specifically to people who are
interested in financial services so you
have to identify that first then once
you've done that you need to figure out
a way to get in contact with the
influencer themselves so looking through
their Instagram you know maybe reaching
out to them and trying to find a find
their contact email or whatever it may
be then once you've got their email you
got to reach out and do all the
back-and-forth and you have to send them
a contract and then you have to
negotiate that contract and then once
that contract has been signed then you
actually have to make sure that whoever
you hire it actually goes and creates
the content because sometimes people may
ghost the campaign or maybe maybe they
don't necessarily want to be a part of
it anymore right yeah life just happens
and that's something I ran into to where
I was paying for promotions and then I
was like okay do I sit here and like
baby them and like message them hey have
you run the promotion or do I just trust
that they're gonna run it so that's
really huge - um so here you are you
said five years into doing this business
yes um I know you can't talk about
specific numbers in terms of revenue and
stuff like that but as far as raising
money can you speak to that a little bit
as far as like what you were able to
raise yeah totally so we've done two
rounds of funding at this point mhm
we've done a proceed round and then we
just recently closed the seed round
we've done in total about close one
point nine to two million dollars okay
and outside capital that we've been able
to raise for the company which has been
it's been super exciting it's definitely
a very different path than what more
traditional businesses would go down as
when you raise that kind of capital
there's a lot of expectations that go
along with it but it's really been
exciting to have the opportunity to do
that and we're like super thankful yeah
I mean that's that's why I was that's
why I reached out to you because that's
very impressive for like at 23 years old
23 and then you're the other tube
founders are they also similar age 20 22
23
so like a group of young guy got guys
all or yep okay I don't want to assume
but I think for video games that's in it
probably a safe bet it's a it's three
names I mean that's pretty cool at at in
your 20s early 20s to raise to almost
two million dollars man that's like
that's not nothing to shake a stick at
you know for sure I never expected that
we've never do it I mean like when when
we first started this it was really for
us at least it was a passion project and
it was something that we just wanted to
help creators like ourselves to be
successful on these platforms like
twitch and the idea that it's like
morphed into this company and like this
venture like this you're back business
now it's just it's it's mind-blowing
right for sure I think it's really
important too for like people who are a
little bit younger watching this I mean
so you started this when you're 18 or so
yeah roughly 18 so I mean this this is
actually with hard work this type of
stuff is actually possible where you
have an idea and then it comes to
fruition then you eventually raise money
with that idea and I think a lot of
people think that I know I certainly did
when I was going through high school I
thought like the only path was like okay
you graduate high school you go to
college then you get a nine-to-five job
and then you work that for forty five
years and eventually retire and so
there's different paths out there and
especially today there's it's like
easier than ever to like get into like
you know entrepreneurship so I kind of
want to circle back and talk more about
maybe your earlier years so like did you
actually go to college or did you not I
because I'm I know I've talked to a lot
of entrepreneurs some of them like don't
agree with college or they dropped out
so I'm just curious like what your take
is on that yeah so I went to Syracuse
University George you know my experience
with college was a really unique one
because what I found with college was
that I had eight I got a tremendous
amount of value out of it in the first
two years that I was there and the key
thing about it is that I think that what
college gave me which I didn't have
anywhere else was time mm-hmm and when
you know when you're living with your
parents or when you're growing up you're
kind of under under their rules in their
household and you know you have all
these different things that are pulling
at you
and for the first time ever when I got
to college the biggest asset that we had
was time like we had so there's just so
much time between like classes that you
could do I was going to business school
so I mean like you know there's that it
wasn't super time constraint yeah I mean
it's not crazy right so being at college
we had I just had so much free time and
I was kind of sitting there and there
was this one speaker that came into
class and gave this talk about how
College is essentially what you make out
of it and it can be you can party the
entire time while you're there you can
start a business you can hang out with
your friends I mean there's so many
different things and the college
experience is really what you make out
of it sure over the day and for me what
really inspired me was it gave me the
ability to be creative and it gave me
and my founders the ability to go out
and just work on something that we
wanted to do mm-hmm
and at the time when we first started
the business we really viewed it as more
of a like I said a passion project right
we didn't think of this as like this is
gonna be like the big venture back of a
business but right yeah we really just
looked at it as this is something that's
fun and this is something that we just
want to continue to create and let's see
how far we can go with it
wow that's really interesting yeah I
mean and I think that's what I found to
most people who start really successful
companies are not starting it from the
standpoint of like oh I'm trying to make
money and you might make it we all
everybody wants everybody has a desire
of like they'd love to make money or
that passive income and stuff like that
and even myself included like not that I
have a I don't have a venture backed
business but I'm even this YouTube
channel when I started I was actually
telling AJ about it off camera to see
why haven't seen him in ten years it was
like what are you up to and I told about
it I was like I just started this as a
hobby on the side I was passionate about
investing and I just started putting up
videos to be helpful so I think that's a
really important lesson here that we
just touched on is like you don't want
to go into things from this viewpoint of
like I'm trying to make money you know
because that's just not the right
attitude and like I don't know how long
did it take you before you even made any
money with this business 3 years 3 years
3 years and then
the first check that we got in the
business was for $20 20 bucks and you
have no idea how excited I was about
that like I litter we had this on campus
Anki Bader where we could go and get
feedback and advice now that was one of
the brilliant things about Cuse was that
they had all these on campus resources
to support entrepreneurs okay so I I
remember I had this mentor in the
Blackstone Launchpad Linda and and she
was always just so enthusiastic about
the company and what we were building
and I remember after three years of just
blood sweat and tears like pushing away
and just trying to create this platform
we finally got one brain to come on and
actually spend $20 $20 what about
unbelievable yeah and I remember I saw
the the check hitter accounts and I got
up and I just started like dancing I was
like screw I was like high-five and
everybody in the hallway like and I
remember just like dancing down to that
incubator and doing a little happy dance
with my mentor down there and you know
looking back music $20 but that's the
that's the first time that you realize
oh my gosh this works you know this is
like proof of concept it's like somebody
else is willing to pay for something
that you've created and it's the best
feeling in the world even if it's you
know even if it's just $20 yeah like the
the point being is that somebody else
found value in something that you
created and it is the most exciting and
exhilarating moment and I think the key
thing that people get lost in when they
start to create a business and what a
lot of people don't realize is that for
most businesses it takes roughly 2 to 3
years to become profitable no matter
what you're doing it takes time because
you have to figure out the problem that
you're solving you have to create the
right solution for it specifically in a
in a venture back business if you're
starting like an accounting firm there's
a way to do that right sure and you can
start making money from day one but the
key thing is that when you're starting a
venture back business it takes time to
actually realize value from that mm-hm
and it's still like even if you look at
these companies like Amazon or uber a
lot of them are even you know 10 15 20
years later they're still not exactly
and part of that is based on their
strategy that they want to prioritize
growth over profits but but really the
the key thing at the end of the day is
that
anything really significant that you
want to create it's gonna take you time
to realize value from and if you're
going into it from the perspective of
I'm building this company to make money
versus I'm building this company in this
business because it's something that I
really care about and it's something
that I'm passionate about I mean that's
what's gonna get you up at six o'clock
in the morning to take the customer that
passion and that excitement that you
have for the business it's what's gonna
get you through the really really I mean
the worst times it's it's hard man and
and you really have to have that passion
for whatever it is that you're working
on otherwise why would I do it alright
so one thing I just thought of while you
were talking about that can you tell me
like what was the what was the darkest
day of the last five years of this where
you were just like one of those moments
where you're maybe questioning what what
the hell am i doing or whatever the
situation may be or something that comes
to mind man there's there's a lotta
that's a great question you know I'd
have to say that one of the I think one
of the biggest mistakes that probably
like the darkest day and one of the
biggest mistakes was not prioritizing
culture from Easter and I think that
this is something that a lot of
first-time founders make a mistake on is
not being able to not putting your
company's culture first and not being a
mission light and values driven and and
for me when I first started this
business I I went to business school and
they teach you about like company values
and company mission and vision and in
business school right
sure and you kind of look at that when
you're in Business School and you're
like oh that's just it seemed so lonely
raised like oh it doesn't matter like my
company vision you know yeah I don't
know who cares about that yeah but in
reality it's the I would argue one of
the single most important things that
any of it well and there's so many
mission and vision statements out there
that are horrible and I think that
that's why it gets a bad rep for what
it's worth but for for us and you know
the way that we look at it it's at the
end of the day
it's what is going to get people excited
about what you're working on like your
mission and what you're focused on it's
what's gonna get people up in the
morning and want to work on this
business and in your vision I mean like
that's where you're going that's your
5-year plan like it should be exciting
it should be inspiring it should make
what people want to be excited about
what you're building mm-hmm and you
should find people who are excited about
that and want to join your organization
to help it succeed because of that and I
and one of the big mistakes that I think
a lot of first-time founders make and
myself included and this this is one of
those mistakes that you really only make
once it's not prioritizing that and
mostly focusing on that and taking that
seriously and I think at the early
stages we we did not do that so what did
you find your initial hires were like
just in it for the money or what was the
issue you're running into yeah you know
there was there were some people that
that definitely didn't work out I mean
the worst part of any any job is having
a let people go I'm sure yeah it's
horrible right
you know it's cuz it's life I mean it's
devastating for them at the end of the
day and it's you know you don't want to
bring that hardship on anyone but a lot
of times it's it's what's right for both
of you because of that individual can't
succeed at your organization
realistically you as their boss you're
holding them back right true true look
at it pull it you've got to let them go
find the place and where they can
succeed and at the end of the day if you
know if you're gonna let someone go you
can you can always help them to to find
that place because at the end of the day
like that's the perspective you got to
come from right is caring about that
person and wanting them to succeed in in
their own role wherever that may be yeah
which is not your organization but
somewhere else still yeah okay so that
would be your worries you get more
details on that I want to cut you off no
no I
yeah well I was just gonna say like I
mean that that's probably the the key
thing and I think that for us really at
the early stages it was something that
we didn't take seriously enough mm-hmm
and when he don't have values and we
don't have a mission or a vision that
you're really focused on adamantly what
ends up happening is you you can hire
people who maybe aren't necessarily a
good fit for your organization because
if you don't know what the values are
that you're looking for and the people
that you hire if you don't know what
your mission is and why people are there
to do it if you're not giving people one
very clear
Job Description and and what they're
supposed to do everyday and when they're
coming into work and on top of that a
very clear definition of success in
terms of letting people know what they
can actually do to be successful in
their day-to-day job what's the metric
that they're pushing forward and what's
the goal if you don't have those things
in place it's very hard for anybody to
succeed in in an environment like that
yeah and so for us I think that our
biggest mistake was was not taking that
seriously enough and and I think that it
really you know there were there was a
day where it really kind of came to a
pen and you know there was people that
were upset I mean it was just like a
very because we didn't have those things
in place it created an environment where
nobody could really succeed and yeah and
it really I think one of the the days
that I look back on that was really
really challenging was just sitting
there and realizing that we have a very
limited capital in the bank we don't
necessarily have a product that's
working yet and we have a culture which
isn't which isn't successful and I
remember just sitting there and seeing
all these things line up and and you're
just what do I do ya know there's
definitely those pivotal points in any
business that you have were like either
what worked before isn't working or
maybe you've been putting all this
effort into one thing and then you
realize this isn't this isn't working
you know and that and that's just and
that's where some people I think you're
either meant to be like an entrepreneur
or you're not because you probably
looked at that as like okay let me
figure this thing out
versus being like okay I give up well
that yeah that was the biggest that was
the biggest thing right and I think I
remember coming back and it was just
such a challenging time because nothing
seemed to be going right like the we
were at the time we were working on the
wrong product the business was heading
in the wrong direction and we weren't
building a space where people could be
successful in mm-hmm
and I remember coming home from this
convention where everything just kind of
came to a tee and everyone was really
nervous on the team about where the
direction of the company was going and
you know what was gonna happen from here
because we were you know really
starting to become tight for cash yeah
venture money is great but it it runs
quick yeah yeah and I remember sitting
there and just thinking like like we're
it's over yeah yeah and it was it
was it was one of those moments and you
know at the end of the day I think that
what really helped us turn it around was
number one establishing those values and
working with the team to figure out what
are what are the things that we care
about as an organization like what are
our core values that we believe in and
for us today it's really clearly
outlined it's radical candor which is
the whole idea that you're gonna care
about other people deeply while
simultaneously challenging them to do
their best work sure it's creativity
like seeking people who can come up with
different unique solutions to problems
we look for people who really value
learning in there as well and I really
have a lot of humility and understand
that it's not about getting to the
solution that makes me feel good it's
about getting to whatever the right
solution is sure yeah I mean our other
writers like collaboration we want to
build a team where everybody can work
together and everybody can help each
other be successful and then positivity
like we want to just build a great place
to work where people can be successful
and I think it was outlining those core
cultural values and then also
implementing a very clear mission and
vision that people could get excited
about and get behind were the key stages
for that and then you know outside of
that once we had those values in place
we transition the team and we found that
you know some people weren't going to be
successful at the organization anymore
and other people were gonna be really
successful yeah so I it was you know a
tough time but at the end of the day
where we ended up landing was we took
the product in a totally different
direction because we had gotten data
from her users that the direction that
we were going in initially was not the
right path mm-hmm and on top of that we
also on top of changing that that
product direction
we really revamped a lot of the ways
that we interact together our processes
the way that we run the business
internally to make sure that we're
building an environment and a culture
where everybody can succeed and
everybody can actually really love
coming into work yeah you're gonna work
30 percent of your life so why be
miserable while you're doing it
it's really interesting that you
mentioned the whole culture thing cuz I
realized as you're saying that that's
why I had such a miserable experience at
my job
I mean working for a utility company
it's not like they have goals like just
the goal is keep the lights on and when
the lights go off get him back on you
know so I that was very interesting you
said I never had like measurable I had
no measurement of success I had no idea
am I good at this job am i horrible I
don't know and so I and it would be like
you're going to work every day and
you're just like what is the point of
any other kind of like the thought
process so that's really interesting
well and just that just to add to that
super sure like it's really the switch
of going from this mentality that you
are I think a lot of people go into
leadership positions thinking that and
this is something that I certainly did
to thinking that you need to know all
the answers if you're the boss and you
need to be the one to solve everything
for everybody and realistically I think
it comes at a principled baseline switch
in the organization where you turn a
switch in your head and instead of
coming at leadership from this
perspective of like hey I'm the boss
like I know everything like that you
know I was supposed to lead it it isn't
really how can I help you
and yeah that's a really good point yeah
rather than that having the the ego or I
got the biggest going on this I got the
highest ha hey or whatever been then act
like you know everything versus like
saying I don't know any of this and then
you're relying on the team yeah and
that's okay you're human right like
everybody everybody's human at the end
of the day like you can't be expected to
know anything and especially if you're a
first time entrepreneur like you're
gonna you're these are mistakes that a
lot of times most companies make these
mistakes sure yeah at the early days and
it's it's hard and it stinks but it's
often times just a lesson that you kind
of have to to learn mm-hmm
and once once you learn it I mean you
never yeah you know it's a mistake that
you never make again
yeah but realistically like at the end
of the day being able to create a
culture where leadership in it is able
to serve and support their people and
help them be successful like for any
leader in organization like that's
what's gonna make people want to work
for you yeah the day definitely so
circling back quick to college did you
graduate
I get graduate okay just barely yeah I
know we were talking and you said things
startup you know the
all started rolling while you're in
college and you're probably looking at
these two things so you're like okay I
got this business that's needs my time
and I got this this degree that's
supposed to teach me how to run business
and I'm the business is already going so
yeah what was that like as far as
balancing school and the business and
then also graduating piece because I
think a lot of people in college like
rather than partying or hanging out like
they want to do what you're saying and
like start a business with their friends
so like what is that whole dynamic like
yeah totally so I'll touch on graduation
for sure what I look like so originally
the plan was that I I remember going to
my parents in December of my senior year
and I had one semester left now it was
like everything was picking up we were
starting to get investment from outside
and outside capital coming into the
business and I felt at that time an
obligation to help support the business
and help make that as successful as
possible so at that time essentially
what ended up happening was I remember
telling my mom and dad hey mom and dad
um I'm not going back in school this
semester that didn't sit very well okay
so you know it was I was really torn
though because I found that I wasn't
necessarily getting the value that I
wanted to get out of school because I
was learning so much more working on
this company and it was like you were
learning five years of experience every
single year that you were working on
this business because there were just so
many problems and um things that you I
mean you don't know what you don't know
right right whenever you start a
business and there's so many little
things that you have to learn that's
gonna make that business be successful
mm-hmm so I remember in my in my senior
year I just felt like I was learning way
more working on this business than going
out and going to college and I I kind of
fish like very like hey you know like
let's go do this and they did that did
not sit well with them and what ended up
happening was we we worked on a
compromise where I would work out of one
of our investors offices in Saratoga and
I would commute from there up to
Syracuse University twice a week to go
to class or classes yeah yeah and it was
it was about a two and a half hour
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